Opening an indoor track.

[askbob]

Having been in and out of the RC hobby since my youth, I've really been thinking of opening an indoor track in my area(Louisville, KY). Currently there are four hobby shops within 20 miles of each other. Two of those have outdoor dirt off-road tracks that have been doing well for several years. The last weekend outdoor race had 80 entrants. About 20 years ago, there were about the same number of hobby shops in the area with several indoor tracks. Actually one of those tracks still exist, but is way off the beaten path about 80 miles out. One hobby shop in my area in particular has a great owner with a wealth of knowledge both on the business end, and the hobbyist side. Mainly deals in helis and planes, but dabbles with cars. Over the winter, he had a small indoor track set-up next door for the Kyosho mini cars. There were probably 25 people who were regular to that weekly. Those are neat, but tend to loose interest.
The space nextdoor can be set-up to be 3500 square feet complete with restroom facilities, heat/air, and well lit. Excellent parking as well. This space is adjacent to the hobby shop and could also have a direct door. The space is also in a prime location with easy access. Lease price is still open for discussion.
We are looking at collaborating by me running the track feeding from the hobby store, and of course vice versa. The plan is to have a nice carpeted off-road style track that could also double as an oval. I would rather do dirt, but I just don't think it would be viable at this point.
So with that bit of information said, I know a lot of members here have been around old and current tracks more than I have, possibly even been on the business end of things too. I'm looking for any help/information that will get this thing off the ground and stay afloat. I'm not looking to make any real money off this deal, just break even and then a few bucks. Mostly for the fun of it. I'd like to hear everyones input on what they like and dislike about any tracks around them and how they could be better. It would also be helpful to get an idea of what most tracks are charging for entrance fees, both for practice and race. Comments please!

[Halgar]

You're going to want to check into insurance coverage before you sign any property leases. It shouldn't be that big of deal, but you know how insurance companies like to make mountains out of mole hills. I'd also check with the building manager to make sure what you're proposing is acceptable to them. Most commercial leases allow tenant improvements, but they must be approved by the owner/manager of the property first. I'd also recommend sticking with carpet tracks rather than dirt because dirt is going to be dusty/dirty, which will ultimately affect your building lease, especially with HVAC equipment being used.

Think long and hard before knocking a door through the wall into the hobby shop. If a break-in occurs from your side, you could be held liable, also, should the relationship go south between you and the hobby shop, you won't want the doorway. If you partner with the hobby shop, do the agreement in writing, stating what each party is bringing to the table, and at least have it notarized if not overseen by an attorney.

[slotcarrod]

I don't think you can make money on the track only. I think you would need to sell parts and car kits to make a real go of it! Rent, utility bills, insurance, supplies and your salary should be a BIG chunk of change.

Plan well and look at your demograph very closly! I wish you the best of luck with your venture!

[askbob]

Thanks for the input thus far guys! Definitely going the carpet route. I'm going to visit a track a few hours away next week that fits into sort of what I'm looking to do. As long as I could make a little side money, I'd be happy. When it comes to selling parts, that is where it becomes tricky with the hobby store. I'm looking for the most simple way to decipher who should get what and I have a great attorney for the legal aspects. The more I look into it, I may want to go it alone parts and all. As far as demographics go, I think I'm right in the sweet spot. Going to test the waters a little more in the coming weeks though.
What is the best/cost efficient material for barrier construction? Something easily changed but yet sturdy enough for track duty. I'm assuming most are using the standard indoor/outdoor carpeting?

[Charlie don't surf]

I have more info, but the best and standard carpet racing surface is Ozite owned by CRC -Calandra Racing Concepts and is expensive.

[tim.sanderson]

Are you talking on road or offroad? You only want ozite for onroad, definitely not for offroad.
For carpet offroad (my fav!), an indoor/outdoor type carpet works best.

*EDIT* now that I read it again, I see you are talking offroad.

Here are a couple of local carpet offroad tracks:

FastCats. (no longer open )
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Speed World.
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[THEYTOOKMYTHUMB]

REO charges $6 to practice all day on any or all of the 4 tracks and $12 first class and $8 each class thereafter. Only about 90 minutes down the road from you. There is indoor and outdoor off-road and oval. I haven't been much this summer. They change the tracks all the time and everyone there is great. Very competitive with huge turnouts and lots of trophy and money races. $500 winner in each class this weekend. Sounds like 2w buggy will be making a comeback too!

http://www.reoraceway.com/

[Charlie don't surf]

And trying to make money or not a business has to make money to survive. The "local" indoor track we had here that had all NC factory drivers is now closed because he was only trying to make his monthly rent for the 25000 Sqft facility on race fees alone- and the truth is the hobby shop is where the income is at, and during good business seasons you have to work hard to get enough capital to get you through the lean months, and that means being strategic in getting new hop ups that the fast guys are winning with- newest tire options, staying ahead of trends in the hobby like not ordering 10 new slash 4WD kits when AE is a month away from releasing the SC4WD, parts that make the mid pack guys think they can win with etc- and wholesalers like HRP and such have substantial minimums for a new shop-

If you really want to have some unbusiness like fun with a track, what about bringing the "club" track back like back in the days where everyone elected the officers, paid dues, and all had a $100 stake in the track or something?

[Halgar]

If you really want to have some unbusiness like fun with a track, what about bringing the "club" track back like back in the days where everyone elected the officers, paid dues, and all had a $100 stake in the track or something?

That's not a half bad idea.

There's a semi-local outdoor track near me like this. There is a group that rents what used to be a horse arena at a community center. The track, maintenance, etc is paid for by donations, sponsors, and race fees. Volunteers all lend a hand for the labor. It's been a few years since I attended a race, but when I did there were at least 20 - 30 guys a week running several rigs each. I believe that they were also ROAR legal so that club race standings made them eligible for ROAR events.

My local woodworkers group essentially does the same thing. They collect yearly dues and have monthly raffles that pay for the monthly meeting hall and several other functions the club hosts throughout the year. Average membership was always above 100 members, monthly meetings drew about 50 - 60.

[CAT3K]

What is the best/cost efficient material for barrier construction? Something easily changed but yet sturdy enough for track duty. I'm assuming most are using the standard indoor/outdoor carpeting?

At my local indoor track we use Prima track GT carpet : http://www.primadirect.co.uk/products/event-exhibition-carpeting/gt-track/

For the barriers we use square gutter downpipe like this : http://www.rainwaterproducts.com/product_detail.asp?From=products.asp&Menu=s21&Sstat=1&Group=33&Key=BR503&NavPage=1 To join it we just use a 12 inch piece of wood that's the same internal size insterted between them.


Here's a pic of a track that the club used for a big onroad meeting :

You can see the guttering works quite well, for bends we use a thick plastic attached to the joining wood so it can be bent to a good curve. There's also velcro on the underside of the guttering so it rarely moves when hit by cars.

Paul.

[askbob]

Thanks again for the great feedback, as I expected no less.
Thumb, about how many turn out to race regularly at the REO facility? All of their pics were not up, but it appears to be a real nice facility. I can only hope to get back the excitement of 2wd buggies. The 'big thing' somehow seems to be the trucks. Even though I have a blast with my nitro trucks, I have never seen the connection between any truck and racing. I do realize however that you have to stick with the poplular trend in racing, but being able to introduce, or re-introduce 2wd buggies would be sweet.
Thanks for the idea of a club track Reg. That is the way it was done with a little track down the road from me in the day. Having been in business for myself for 12 years now, I'm trying to make this more of a fun side item without so much of the stress. Not sure if that is gonna be possible though. The more I crunch the numbers, the more I'm thinking a shop within the track will be key like you said. That blows the idea of being next door to a shop though. Finding middle ground between my track, and the shop next door would be best. He doesn't want to have the responsibility of the track, and I really don't want the responsibility of a store front.
The 3500 square foot area usually rents for $10 a square foot! This particular space has been vacant for almost 4 years and the property owner has many other vacancies in the immediate area. If I can get it at half or near that, I think it'll work out. The hobby shop owner is pretty tight with the owner and is in the process of working out a price deal.
Does $20 for race day fees sound too high? To me $20 for a full day of racing seems on par these days.

[tamiyadan]

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[askbob]

That is the sobering truth dan! Todays kids are far different than even my generation. Having two daughters, I notice how things are these days especially at social events such as softball or school funcitons. Not sure if anyone else has noticed, but it really seems to me that the boys are ultra babified and the girls are way tougher these days. I sometimes wonder what the world will look like in another 10-20 years. Still looking ahead to the track deal, but forming a more club oriented deal.

[THEYTOOKMYTHUMB]

[THEYTOOKMYTHUMB]