Le Mans motor restorations

[coxbros1]

This is the hardest Le Mans to find, Period...unless u have an original Turbo Scorpion. Its the Holiest of Holy Grails! Adjustable timing/bushings just like a 600e. Its all original, factory brushes, barely ran (not rebuilt) but does of a new MCI decal

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Nice! Do you have every 3 piece Le Mans motor now?

Yup!

[R6cowboy]

No holy grail, but I just missed a really nice looking Le Mans 600E I had in my watchlist. Ended about 11pm last night but I fell asleep around 10. Only 1 bid for $60. Dang it!

[coxbros1]

There cool for sure!...my brother scored one this winter in hopes of putting it in a Kyosho Fantom 4wd but our current circumstances are going to end that idea....so I put it in his Ultima, that white Le Mans looks great in that white Ultima....I havent ran it yet but the motor is a fresh resto with new bushings, brushes, comm cut and decal...he will probably enter it in BOTM sonetime so he can get his one vote

[R6cowboy]

Now I'm looking for motor shims/spacers that go on the shaft on each end of the armature. Some of those shims fell out in small pieces when disassembling some of my old motors. So have some questions.

The spacer at the bottom of the can: are those always metal, and not teflon (I think those are teflon, correct)? And is only one shim always needed at this end?
The spacer/shims at the comm/endbell side: are those always teflon with one metal shim at the very end between the teflon shim and the bearing or bushing?
How many shims do we know to use on either end?
Also, where do you prefer to get them (teflon and metal ones)? I found some at Amain, but don't know if they're a decent deal or overpriced since I've never looked for these before.

[Coelacanth]

I shim my motors so there's just the tiniest bit of play in the comm when installed in the can and endbell screwed down; you feel the slightest bit of play when tugging on the pinion shaft. If there's no play at all, you risk having friction, and if there's too much play, you wear things out quicker.

[juicedcoupe]

I buy M3 stainless washers at Lowes. They seem to work fine.

On a bushing motor, I try to put brass or teflon against the bushing itself.

[coxbros1]

Update: me and The Diamond One realized some testing issues regarding the 480gold vs the 240 motors. We were testing in a vintage Salute that had Thorp overdrive gears in it from when the car ran mod dirt oval in the 80s...that along with a big pinion made the 480/360 motors really seem good...and the 240s would pull the gear too. It wasnt until we ran the Optima Pro with a tall pinion that we could see the overall gear ratio difference. A 480 motor with stock gearing in an Optima is pretty slow. So bottom line Coel was right all along...and now we must suffer the shame of being wrong :
We still really dig 480golds (on the shelf!)

[R6cowboy]

There's no shame in manning up and admitting when one is wrong, only shows good character. And any news is good news when it comes to the performance comparisons between these vintage motors. 480Gold is righteous regardless.

[Coelacanth]

There's no shame in being wrong, and it's easy to overlook a detail like the Thorp overdrive gearing...I have to blame you for motivating me to buy a cheap digital tach and setting up a brushed motor RPM station as you had me second-guessing myself with my own motors! The results all seemed to be in line with what I suspected, but the motor testing outside-of-the-car wouldn't explain why one car would go faster with an 8-minute motor than a 4-minute motor. I appreciate your re-testing so my world can go right again.

[coxbros1]

....and i think the reason the 240sb and 240spa werent as fast in that Salute was because it was extremely over geared...i might retest em in the Optima Pro which has all stock gearing

[Coelacanth]

Might I suggest either an 11T or 12T pinion gear, assuming you're running otherwise stock gearing and wheels/tires on that Optima Pro? I assume it has the same 3.03 internal transmission gear ratio and 41T spur gear as the Optima/Turbo Optima had. A 12T would get you closest to a theoretically optimal final rollout ratio of 1.00", give or take 10% (0.90" to 1.10")...if you're looking for more torque, go with an 11T. It would be great if you let us know which pinion you went with and how you felt it performed!

[coxbros1]

yup...i will update it when i find out

[coxbros1]

Got some updates....I ran the 240spa, 480spa, and my display 240s. I used the Optima Pro which is standard Optima gearing with 32p gears. I started with the 240Spa and a 12 tooth pinion and bumped timing on can to 4 degrees. It had great torque but it was slow, so i put a 16t on and it really picked up, good speed felt real decent, took a couple seconds before it topped out. Then i tried the 480spa at 6 degrees same gear. Just a tick slower than the 240spa but respectable. Then came the 240s right from the display case...cranked 6 degrees in it and same 16t gear. It was by far the fastest with great torque. All these motors are used and rebuilt so who knows how they would run compared to NIB. But my overall opinion is that the 240s is the best overall performing Le Mans ever made and highly underrated. I have several and they all run similar. If more teams ran em at the 87' Ifmar champs the outcome would be much different than what happened (with the exception of Masami...he wasn't gonna be beat)

[GoMachV]

Ahh man I already got the 480g tattoo on my arm this sucks worse than when Dale Jr changed numbers.

[Coelacanth]

I don't think the 240S was ever underrated. Most anybody you talk to says they're fantastic.