Club level competitiveness

[Superathlete]

Hey all, i’m really liking the idea of building a rc10 buggy to be competitive at a club level….are these chassis able to keep up with modern 2wd cars? I race a pretty modded xx4 with fairly good results against modern 4wd buggies. Any thoughts on this the rc10 performance?

[Elkcycles]

Not on par for modern performance. Mid motors dominate on carpet tracks, but a well set up rear motor buggy in 17.5 will be about a second or two off a mid motor car, so no slouch either.

[scr8p]

Yeah, it really depends on the surface. A dusty dirt track is a great equalizer.

[Superathlete]

Not on par for modern performance. Mid motors dominate on carpet tracks, but a well set up rear motor buggy in 17.5 will be about a second or two off a mid motor car, so no slouch either.

Would that be due to just the CG being moved forward and more weight over the front wheels? I only ask this because in the real racing world rear edge Porsches have done extremely well over the years, comparatively speaking. So it’s hard for me to understand why rear motor layouts aren’t as fast.

[LowClassCC]

Not on par for modern performance. Mid motors dominate on carpet tracks, but a well set up rear motor buggy in 17.5 will be about a second or two off a mid motor car, so no slouch either.

Would that be due to just the CG being moved forward and more weight over the front wheels? I only ask this because in the real racing world rear edge Porsches have done extremely well over the years, comparatively speaking. So it’s hard for me to understand why rear motor layouts aren’t as fast.

My son raced a rc10 dirt oval conversion against modern dirt oval cars. he finished 4th or 5th each week out of a field of 30+. He could never pull off a win though. A huge issue was weight. The old rc10 was just much too heavy to launch out of the turn onto the strait like the lighter modern cars.

I would agree the rc10 would be much more competitive on a oldschool track that is rough, blown out, loose dusty style track. On my track we run mostly rear motor cars and the rc10 does fine. Mid motor cars on the other hand always seem to be trying to find rear traction.

[1911Colt]

it’s hard for me to understand why rear motor layouts aren’t as fast.

With modern RC tracks and tires, there is no to need hang massive weights over the rear tires to get forward traction, so the designers have gravitated towards centering the mass between the wheels for better turning and quicker direction changes. They gain steering and corner speed without sacrificing acceleration.

Also, I think the "negative" effect of the rear motor is exaggerated now that battery weight is so much less. Heavy NiCads helped balance the car in spite of the motor weight being in the rear. A vintage buggy with a LiPo sitting in pretty much the same place the NiCad used to sit will have a significantly higher
percentage of its weight on the rear tires.

Fun topic thanks for posting it!

[Superathlete]

it’s hard for me to understand why rear motor layouts aren’t as fast.

With modern RC tracks and tires, there is no to need hang massive weights over the rear tires to get forward traction, so the designers have gravitated towards centering the mass between the wheels for better turning and quicker direction changes. They gain steering and corner speed without sacrificing acceleration.

Also, I think the "negative" effect of the rear motor is exaggerated now that battery weight is so much less. Heavy NiCads helped balance the car in spite of the motor weight being in the rear. A vintage buggy with a LiPo sitting in pretty much the same place the NiCad used to sit will have a significantly higher
percentage of its weight on the rear tires.

Fun topic thanks for posting it!

Interesting thought….I didn’t think about the battery weight of then vs now and i guess long are the days of real offroad tracks for 1/10. Everything is prepped more maximum grip. You’d almost need to add some weight up front to balance a rear motor buggy now.

[Charlie don't surf]

They can be club level competitive, but I'm at least .70 off the fast lap pace...every lap lol. I've A Mained a fair amount even had two 3rd overall finishes last year. The old geometry is just... old. Less corner speed, way less on exit. Still it's fun to see how close you can get lap wise. Weight in the battery area is OK to aid handling, weight over the nose helps too. 50% of racers don't agree with the weight for handling concept but the puzzle of making it close is pretty cool. I've raced nothing but vintage stuff at club level for at least a year and a half, modern race level electronics, correct tire prep and you can get closer to them than you might think

[Superathlete]

modern race level electronics, correct tire prep and you can get closer to them than you might think

For sure! I’ve have great results with my xx4. Just need to spend a little more time on prep and setup but its worth it in the end. Stupidly i sold a worlds rere when they came out and have some original shelf queens that wont touch the dirt. Think im going to wait for a rere ce, graphite or another worlds maybe….whatever long arm car they come out with first. Hopefully soon!

[jeepy2013]

Been awhile since a reply on this thread and I don't get on here as much as I'd like (always seem to get sucked into FB) Anyways, this is something I've been thinking about and working on. Currently building my own "worlds car" version with a CC chassis, Fan RC worlds car racer's kit, modern electronics, 2.2 wheels, etc. I haven't raced in 5 years, haven't been on a track in probably 3 or 4 years at all. I'm thinking there's no way I'd be anywhere near competitive with this car in the 17.5 buggy classes, so leaning towards 21.5 in this one, figure it'll be easier on me and the car....lol I'm still on the fence with 17.5 vs 21.5Will be running at a indoor clay track, I do plan on attending the Tamiya Vintage World Classic next year, I think I'd have to run 17.5 in this car there. (which is ok)

[RCveteran]

Are you "that guy" that seems to set track records and win the A main no matter what you drive? Or are you a mid pack D main idiot like me? The answer probably has more to do with that.

[jeepy2013]

When I raced 2wd buggy all the time, I was always in the A main, didn't win too often...lol. Mostly top 5 and some top 3 finishes though. I haven't raced in 5 years now, so taking this "vintage" car into the "modern" 17.5 buggy class would probably be laughable at this point lol. I think I'll stick a 21.5 in it and run the 21.5 "Independent" buggy class with it.....mainly to get back into the swing of things. I have a 6.1D I can run in 17.5 I know I'm not going to be very competitive in either for awhile, I'm over 50 with no track time in a long time

[RCveteran]

Sounds like a good plan. This question comes up a lot. The thing about club level racing is you never know what the club is for anyone. You might win the A main with a Hornet at any given race but the field of drivers was not a competitive bunch. Two equally good skilled drivers one with a vintage buggy and one with modern, as said before the modern is faster. Suspension geometry, weight distribution and on and on are all just "better".

You will fight harder to turn clean laps on these high grips surfaces with a vintage car. If that is what you want to do nothing wrong with that. If you're goal is to win though buy a Traxxas Bandit, just kidding, though arguably it had better suspension geometry than an RC10.

[Charlie don't surf]

Been awhile since a reply on this thread and I don't get on here as much as I'd like (always seem to get sucked into FB) Anyways, this is something I've been thinking about and working on. Currently building my own "worlds car" version with a CC chassis, Fan RC worlds car racer's kit, modern electronics, 2.2 wheels, etc. I haven't raced in 5 years, haven't been on a track in probably 3 or 4 years at all. I'm thinking there's no way I'd be anywhere near competitive with this car in the 17.5 buggy classes, so leaning towards 21.5 in this one, figure it'll be easier on me and the car....lol I'm still on the fence with 17.5 vs 21.5Will be running at a indoor clay track, I do plan on attending the Tamiya Vintage World Classic next year, I think I'd have to run 17.5 in this car there. (which is ok)

I race vintage stuff weekly (and at the track that the Tamiya Vintage World Classic is held) they are competitive and I've Amained a few series races by clean running, and TQ'd twice with my 21.5 car against a field of modern cars- hit me up for some baseline setups if you'd like. The cars are durable and a blast. Where are you located?

[jeepy2013]

I race vintage stuff weekly (and at the track that the Tamiya Vintage World Classic is held) they are competitive and I've Amained a few series races by clean running, and TQ'd twice with my 21.5 car against a field of modern cars- hit me up for some baseline setups if you'd like. The cars are durable and a blast. Where are you located?

Thank You, it looks like you all have a great track up there! (I'm in FL). A good friend of mine lives up in Apex and we've been talking about coming to the vintage race next year, just couldn't make it this year. I'll send you a PM, definitely interested in some track info, setup info, tires, etc.