The late Graphite Team Car

[nitrous36]

Thats really cool. I wonder how well it can compete against the newer cars.

With equal drivers, they don't. Even in heavily modified form, they are at a huge disadvantage. Let's face it, 30+ years is a lot of technology to overcome.


I compare these to a classic muscle car. They might get driven around a little and show up to a vintage event, but they usually just sit around and look pretty.

You're right. They look nice, was hoping they could still be competitive. But they're rare. So theres the cool factor. I like the oldschool graphite stuff.

[Frankentruck]

Thats really cool. I wonder how well it can compete against the newer cars.

With equal drivers, they don't. Even in heavily modified form, they are at a huge disadvantage. Let's face it, 30+ years is a lot of technology to overcome.


I compare these to a classic muscle car. They might get driven around a little and show up to a vintage event, but they usually just sit around and look pretty.

You're right. They look nice, was hoping they could still be competitive. But they're rare. So theres the cool factor. I like the oldschool graphite stuff.

I don't know if it's quite as simple as newest = best. If both are at minimum required race weight, both have the same motor/battery/controls setup, both have the same tire pattern and compound, and both have had the shocks setup properly for the track, I find it difficult not to say it could be a very even race. If everything on the old school car has to be old school (battery, electronics, etc) then sure the modern car has the advantage. But mechanical technology isn't so different now vs what it was then. Probably the main difference is the change to mid-motor position in modern stuff vs rear motor for a change in chassis balance.

[juicedcoupe]

Mid motor, longer suspension, stiffer chassis, better balance, better transmission and slipper.

[nitrous36]

Yep. Was going to say, mechanically the modern cars into the 00s werent too different. Until the mid egine designs and cab forward bodies came out. Besides the change to brushless and lipo, mid engine chassis were probably the biggest change to come in a long time.

[XLR8]

Thats really cool. I wonder how well it can compete against the newer cars.

With equal drivers, they don't. Even in heavily modified form, they are at a huge disadvantage. Let's face it, 30+ years is a lot of technology to overcome.


I compare these to a classic muscle car. They might get driven around a little and show up to a vintage event, but they usually just sit around and look pretty.

You're right. They look nice, was hoping they could still be competitive. But they're rare. So theres the cool factor. I like the oldschool graphite stuff.

I don't know if it's quite as simple as newest = best. If both are at minimum required race weight, both have the same motor/battery/controls setup, both have the same tire pattern and compound, and both have had the shocks setup properly for the track, I find it difficult not to say it could be a very even race. If everything on the old school car has to be old school (battery, electronics, etc) then sure the modern car has the advantage. But mechanical technology isn't so different now vs what it was then. Probably the main difference is the change to mid-motor position in modern stuff vs rear motor for a change in chassis balance.

I used to think the same until I drove a B4 for the first time.
Suspension geometry plays a big part in how the car jumps, enters and exits a corner.
I'm easily able to beat my highly modified RC10's lap times with a box stock B4 - running the same motors, batteries and tires.
I can only imagine what it's like to drive a B6.

[nitrous36]

You have to wonder sometimes if theyve hitba plateau with the new models though. Updates/changes seem minimal between the new models now. Could be a while before something radical comes along.

[HS-YZ250]

You have to wonder sometimes if theyve hitba plateau with the new models though. Updates/changes seem minimal between the new models now. Could be a while before something radical comes along.

That's pretty typical across the board with all forms of racing, these days. With the accessibility of computing power, sophisticated simulation tools, and relatively cheap fabrication, everything's converged on an ideal form for whatever discipline they're competing in. Unless the tracks change significantly, like if everyone decides they want to go back to tilled loam or something like endurocross, or there's a major rules change, the cars will continue to be iterations of the same basic form.


Dirt bikes reached this point a while ago. The four japanese companies and KTM have been iterating small refinements on their same basic bikes for years. One day BMW decided they wanted to upend the industry and came in with a dramatically different bike from everyone else. They were greeted with reviews proclaiming it to be "The worst riding bike they've ever been on" and nobody bought it. They scrapped their dirt bike ambitions after that.

[nitrous36]

You have to wonder sometimes if theyve hitba plateau with the new models though. Updates/changes seem minimal between the new models now. Could be a while before something radical comes along.

That's pretty typical across the board with all forms of racing, these days. With the accessibility of computing power, sophisticated simulation tools, and relatively cheap fabrication, everything's converged on an ideal form for whatever discipline they're competing in. Unless the tracks change significantly, like if everyone decides they want to go back to tilled loam or something like endurocross, or there's a major rules change, the cars will continue to be iterations of the same basic form.


Dirt bikes reached this point a while ago. The four japanese companies and KTM have been iterating small refinements on their same basic bikes for years. One day BMW decided they wanted to upend the industry and came in with a dramatically different bike from everyone else. They were greeted with reviews proclaiming it to be "The worst riding bike they've ever been on" and nobody bought it. They scrapped their dirt bike ambitions after that.

Didn't know that bit about BMW. I knew they got into sport bikes in the late 00s and made a wave. It was pretty good. Ill have to check out their dirt bike adventure. Sounds interesting. But yeah similarly, sport bikes reached a plateau around the mid/late 00s. Then tightening emission laws and the recession further stifled development. Then add that the general public just isnt buying motorcycles like they used to.

Sorry for the off topic. But I think bikes in general are in trouble. As a rider that worries me.

[HS-YZ250]

Didn't know that bit about BMW. I knew they got into sport bikes in the late 00s and made a wave. It was pretty good. Ill have to check out their dirt bike adventure. Sounds interesting. But yeah similarly, sport bikes reached a plateau around the mid/late 00s. Then tightening emission laws and the recession further stifled development. Then add that the general public just isnt buying motorcycles like they used to.

Sorry for the off topic. But I think bikes in general are in trouble. As a rider that worries me.

Here's a blurb about it. https://motocrossactionmag.com/forgotten-motocross-tech-do-you-remember-when-bmw-made-a-dirt-bike/

I've been hearing that Triumph is going to take a stab at dirt bikes, soon, and have hired a few big names to promote it. I'm curious how that will turn out.

And with that, I'll stop hijacking this thread!

[MarkyDents]

This one grew some legs of its own hehe

[MarkyDents]

Okay fine I’ll take it apart

[juicedcoupe]

Okay fine I’ll take it apart

https://youtu.be/B_O5VW7A0Uw



If cleaning your aluminum pieces, be sure to use a cleaner that is safe. I use the Simple Green Pro HD (purple color), from Home Depot. I've never had a problem with it discoloring aluminum.

[MarkyDents]

I remember that commercial
Thank you for the heads up on the cleaning of aluminum parts.
What ratio to water do you do ? With or without the heat function ?

[juicedcoupe]

I remember that commercial
Thank you for the heads up on the cleaning of aluminum parts.
What ratio to water do you do ? With or without the heat function ?

I usually use a cup and then add water to the full mark. I have the same machine as you.

And I definitely use heat, it works better. If I'm doing a fresh batch, I add hot water to speed up the process. Otherwise, I turn the heat on beforehand.

[juicedcoupe]

Oh yeah. For hardware and small pieces, a mesh tea ball works great.

They aren't but a few dollars at Walmart. Just be careful when removing them, as the latch pulls open kinda easy.