B4 slipper to V2 to VTS evolution - the reasons

[alcyon]

I am not entirely familiar with associated buggies as I have never owned one. I did however decide to make a layshaft that uses B4 slipper and spur gear on my Kyosho optima mid and lazer ZX. I am currently using the standard B4 slipper. I find some problems with it, which I wonder if its inherent in the standard b4 clutch as well. To align the plates and spur properly, I find that I have to press in the outer plate as evenly as possible then tighten the spring.
After some hard knocks while running the car, I notice some spur noise and upon checking I find that the spur and both inner and outer plates wobbles side to side. 1st question, is this normal with the standard B4 slipper ? My gut feeling is yes, because the spring does not support the plate completely and evenly. Which brings me to my next question, is that why associated came out with the V2 and VTS?
I had a look at the VTS design and I believe it will solve this problem. It would be great to hear from those in the know. I have ordered a VTS conversion and I may have to wait for 2 weeks for it to arrive.

[The Gweed]

I would start by checking your top shaft. I have received ones that are not machined properly. This will cause anything from the inside diff half to hit the motor plate, wobble, or not allow the diff to tighten properly. I race tomorrow so when I take mine apart Monday I will measure it and let u know. Or if your local shop might let u measure one of theirs..

[integra22t]

i just got a b4 and rebuilt it .. i found it was a little tricky to install the slipper disks on the spur and get it on the shaft without one of the disks moving and making the spur wobble .. i ended taking the inner and outer plates and sammich the spur and disks and instal that way

if that isnt the problem then it might be the top shaft

[The Gweed]

Correction to my post I ment clutch not diff sorry for the mistake

[alcyon]

Thanks for the input guys. Now the 1000$ question..have you guys used the v2 or the vts, and do those solve the wobbling problems?

[harvey]

The v2 spring definitely spreads the load better due to it's larger diameter. However, it is my feeling that the b4 slipper was intended to be used as originally designed on the b4 tranny; that is with a positive stop on the inboard slipper plate which compresses the entire assembly evenly. If you are relying on the sharp edges of the two flat spots on the top shaft to evenly support the inner plate and act as a positive stop... can you see where this is not as good as it could be? Perhaps you can use a crush tube on the top shaft just like the b4 does, and make sure it presses up against the inner race of the top shaft bearing. This is what I have done to the stealth trannies I have retrofitted the b4 slipper to, and yes I'll open up the case to allow the crush tube to contact the bearing (the crush tube on the b4 is inside the case). Try something like these:

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LX2983&P=7

There is a nice thin alloy one in this kit, as well as some thin steel shims to get it just right:

http://www3.towerhobbies.com/cgi-bin/wti0001p?&I=LXNZ97&P=7

Cheers, and great job on the mods!

[The Gweed]

I currently use the VTS but I have used the V2. Based on your description there are only a few possible reasons for your issue.
1. The inside slipper pad is not seated into the spur gear properly causing the assembly not to compress correctly.
2. Your spur gear is warped. Sometimes the chemicals people clean them with cause them to soften and warp.
3. The top shaft is not machined properly causing the inside clutch plate to touch the motor plate or not to be parallel to the motor plate.
4. Your outside clutch pad basket is not seated into your spur gear or warped.
5. The spring is bad.
6. Your clutch rotor "the metal disc between your outer clutch pads" is bent.
7. Your nut is stripped.

All applies for both v2 or VTS except 4 and 6 are VTS only
Hope this helps.

[alcyon]

Seems you guys are right. I placed three 0.3mm brass shims behind the inner plate to stiffen it up and the problem is more or less gone.

[Seabass]

The VTS simply was designed to allow the use of three clutch pads VS two. Many found the V1 and V2 slipper assembly would allow the clutch pads to glaze over causing inconsistent slipper operation. The VTS was created to reduce the changes of glazing your pads.

I was going to suggest checking your top shaft as well. I have used countless numbers of the B4 series slipper assemblies and never did I encounter a problem that did not involve a breakdown from the top shaft.

Jake