Kyosho Ultima II

[DePingus]

So I dug this out of deep storage last week!


Let's look inside!


Is that 24 years of dust in there!?


High tech mechanical speed control.


Le Mans Stock motor.
The missing wing and mounts are in my tool box. I forgot why I even removed them.




How badly beat up is it? Not bad at all!


How about the radio transmitter? Like new!


Classic gear!


Here's my DieHard NiCD. It's even older than the Ultima II.
It came from a Sears Lobo II. The last remaining piece of that relic is in the pic.


I ordered a new NiCD for the buggy and battery holder for the Futaba transmitter. Then I set out to find new tires to replace those old baldies. And THAT'S when I discovered that this thing is considered "vintage"! For a second there I though I had bit off more than I could chew, but with the help of some of your awesome members I've ordered new a set of CRP 1712 font axles that can fit modern Tamiya wheels and 2.2" tires on this old buggy.

I received my Tamiya wheels and Pro-Line Dirt Hawg tires already. These things are HUGE! Still waiting for my tire glue though...

Next on the shopping list is an ESC, full bearing set, faster motor, maybe Li-Po conversion and probably a new body.

Side note: For the holidays I bought my brother in law a new, disassembled Tamiya Dark Impact 4WD DF03 and some starter gear to get it up and running.

Hopefully I can give him a good run when I'm done with this vintage buggy!

Thanks to to the guys who helped me over PM! I'll keep posting pics as it comes along.

[DePingus]

Ugh. That just broke!


The plastic...uh...ring thing...that goes on the ball joint part there is cracked (lower left by the wheel) and came off it's rod.
Luckily, I have a spare in my old tool box!

I should look into replacing these with sturdier parts though.

[Mr. ED]

the common term is ball-end I believe.
Was your car stored in a very dry place for the last years?

Those parts are made of nylon. It gets its natural souplenes from the wather it contains and gets brittle when the material dries out.
It might be a good idea to boil your nylon parts (not sure about the Kelron, but I think it will be ok).
Quite some work, but you might see other parts breaking if you don't.
Don't bother taking the gearbox apart though: no need to boil the caes or anything in-there.

[Coelacanth]

Ball-ends are cheap and easily replaced, and if that's the worst of your damage, you're laughing. If it were me, I'd disassemble the gearbox and check the gears and re-lubricate them & the bearings...unless my goal was to merely clean it up with a minimal amount of effort.

[DePingus]

The car was stored on a shelf in an air conditioned room. I happened to have a spare ball-end in my tool box so I was able to get that one replaced. But I did notice a slight crack on another one though. I recall snapping some of these as a kid, probably over tightened then. So I'll be ordering a new set all around.

Boiling the nylon parts sounds like quite a project. I haven't been able to find the manual, which I know is somewhere in the same room. With that I should be able to take it all apart and put it back together, so I'll check that out then.

I gave a new tires a quick run (pics coming soon) on the asphalt and those things can grip the ground! I flipped the car on the first turn. I'll refrain from running it until I get in there with a new bearing kit and clean out the gearbox.

Thanks for the advice and happy holidays!

[Mr. ED]

With those larger tires you'll have to lower the car : mount the shocks to the upper hole and most outward on the bottom. That'll help to stop it from tipping over.
You might want to refill the shocks also with new , maybe thicker oil. Adjust the ride height with those turn collars too.

[DePingus]

New wheels and tires. Shocks adjusted. New ball ends on order.
IIRC I had previously moved the shocks way down to increase the ride height because the back end would slap the ground with the lower profile street tires I had put on.
That's also why I removed the wing mounts, I was using one of the mount's holes for the shock.

[DePingus]

As I type, there is a HiForce 320A ESC with my name on it taking a boat ride from China.
And I've got a birthday coming up...So that means upgrades!!!

First up; my 1500 NiCD and Hobbico 900 only give me about 3-4 minutes of run time. So I'm looking at a LiPo conversion! I've done a bunch of research and I think I'll be getting a Turnigy Accucel-6 balance charger and Zippy 4000 2S hardcase LiPo battery from HobbyKing. Along with a low voltage alarm and LiPo charging bag. As the buggy stands now, stock, after 4 minutes the motor plugs get hot enough to stick to the old paint on the body. So I'll be replacing the battery and motor connectors with XT60 plugs. Unless, of course, any one here has any better suggestions.

I have some questions though:

- What's the deal with shock oil? Thicker oil was suggested earlier. But all I know is that the Kyosho original oil is "green medium". I don't know what that means in terms of actual weight. Should I go with 30W / 350cst or higher?

- I still have some of the original Kyosho gear grease. Is that still good or is there something else I should be lubing my gears up with? If that's still good, what's a modern replacement for when I run out?

- Motor upgrade time!!!
I want to keep up with modern cars and this Le Mans Stock 05 is old and not particularly quick. The ESC I ordered above recommends a 540 15T brushed motor (but can run up to 12T). 15T motors are cheap! Easy-rc.com's gearing tools aren't working for me. Do I need a new pinion, spur, and/or any other gears? Which ones, how do I calculate? Can this buggy even handle a 15T motor? I want this to go fast, but I don't want to burn it up. Any recommendations that won't break the bank or the buggy?

- Speaking of the new ESC...I assume that I can remove the ceramic heat sink and it's cage after installing the new ESC. Correct?

[Mr. ED]

Filled in where I could:

As I type, there is a HiForce 320A ESC with my name on it taking a boat ride from China.
And I've got a birthday coming up...So that means upgrades!!!

First up; my 1500 NiCD and Hobbico 900 only give me about 3-4 minutes of run time. So I'm looking at a LiPo conversion! I've done a bunch of research and I think I'll be getting a Turnigy Accucel-6 balance charger and Zippy 4000 2S hardcase LiPo battery from HobbyKing. Along with a low voltage alarm and LiPo charging bag. As the buggy stands now, stock, after 4 minutes the motor plugs get hot enough to stick to the old paint on the body. So I'll be replacing the battery and motor connectors with XT60 plugs. Unless, of course, any one here has any better suggestions.

If the esc moter wires are long enough you could solder them directly to the moter. If you use connectors on both the moter and accu leads, then mount them such that the genders prevent any mistakes. I once put the accu on the moter leads of an old LRP ESC.... pouf and white smoke... death

I have some questions though:

- What's the deal with shock oil? Thicker oil was suggested earlier. But all I know is that the Kyosho original oil is "green medium". I don't know what that means in terms of actual weight. Should I go with 30W / 350cst or higher?

- I still have some of the original Kyosho gear grease. Is that still good or is there something else I should be lubing my gears up with? If that's still good, what's a modern replacement for when I run out?

- Motor upgrade time!!!
I want to keep up with modern cars and this Le Mans Stock 05 is old and not particularly quick. The ESC I ordered above recommends a 540 15T brushed motor (but can run up to 12T). 15T motors are cheap! Easy-rc.com's gearing tools aren't working for me. Do I need a new pinion, spur, and/or any other gears? Which ones, how do I calculate? Can this buggy even handle a 15T motor? I want this to go fast, but I don't want to burn it up.

With those larger tires and a hotter moter you should definitely gear down somewhat. A rough guess on my side would be 12 tooth on a standard size 32dp spur. Take hardcoated pinion : it will last longe rand the longer the pinion lasts, the longer the spur will last too.

Any recommendations that won't break the bank or the buggy?

- Speaking of the new ESC...I assume that I can remove the ceramic heat sink and it's cage after installing the new ESC. Correct?

yup

[Coelacanth]

You'll get rid of a lot of fugly wiring and some weight when you lose the MSC. I'll add a suggestion about motor-to-ESC wiring though: I don't suggest soldering them unless you're absolutely certain of correct motor rotation. Most of my modern ESCs/motors ended up spinning the wrong way, when I connected the wires according to the colors...maybe that's because most modern cars are mid-motored and typically rotate the opposite way...at any rate, I solder 3.5mm bullet connectors to the ends of the wires connecting my motors to ESC's, because all you need to do is swap 2 wires to reverse the motor direction....and you can swap out motors a lot easier.

[Mr. ED]

You'll get rid of a lot of fugly wiring and some weight when you lose the MSC. I'll add a suggestion about motor-to-ESC wiring though: I don't suggest soldering them unless you're absolutely certain of correct motor rotation. Most of my modern ESCs/motors ended up spinning the wrong way, when I connected the wires according to the colors...maybe that's because most modern cars are mid-motored and typically rotate the opposite way......

That's just murphy's law
Anyway; it doesn't hurt anything if your moter spins backwards, just try gently and don't go full throttle. If it's wrong you just swap the soldering.
Coel's remarks make sense, but I don't suppose you plan to switch moters frequently

[DePingus]

Thanks again for the advice.

I just ordered an Arrma AR390031 Mega brushed 15T 540 motor along with a Robinson Racing 1712 Super Hard "Absolute" steel pinion (32P 12T with a 1/8th" bore).

I have to wait for my bday to get the HobbyKing order (battery, charger, connectors). So it will be a couple weeks before I can put this all together. Waiting will be the hardest part!

Later on I'll probably do a new body and then shelve this buggy. I've already put up about $125; all these little things really start to add up! I should start saving for something modern that can go faster and has parts that are easier to find.

[Mr. ED]

I've been very tempted at giving Tamiyas latest 2 wd buggy a try: the neo-fighter dt-03.
It's not a top of the line buggy but the really cheap kit includes the stock motor and a basic esc which even supports a brushless motor.
(I guess something down to 13.5T max)

Sounds ideal for you: you could keep both ESC's installed and use your newly purchased road tires and wheels on both models. Drop the new stock motor in the ultima and the 15T into the dt-03.

New body... I'd save that money up for a better servo, maybe a new radio too. The old body is carrying more memories than a new one will.

[DePingus]

What a coincidence! I was checking out the Neo Fighter a couple days ago. I think that's what made me rethink what I'm doing with this Ultima. All I wanted was a battery clip and some fresh rubber. I never thought I would be $150 deep into this rabbit hole. (Oh yeah, I ordered the Fast Eddy bearing kit, 30w and 40w shock oil, and Kyosho grease.)

It's too late to stop now. This Ultima is going to run, and it's going to be fun. So I might as well run it right. That's why I bought the bearings and lube. I do agree about the body. It's not broken or anything. There's really no point in changing it other than giving it a nicer paint job. I think that's it for this car now. Well...I hope that's it for this car!

Next up is the power system from HK which will be about $80 shipped. But that's going to be gifted and will all transfer to the next car so I'm not counting it as part of this Ultima re-build.

[DePingus]

I pulled the gear box and diff apart.


Everything looks pretty good in there.


I cleaned everything and it all went back together nicely...with new ball bearings in place.

I also finally found THIS...


As soon as I have some time at the office I'll scan and upload it somewhere.
It's the only vintage Ultima manual I couldn't find online.